Chariots beating Skirmishers, not by double

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Piyan Glupak
Levy
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Chariots beating Skirmishers, not by double

Postby Piyan Glupak » Mon Jul 16, 2018 1:53 pm

Hello there, I hope that those who went to Historicon had a really good time.

I hope that I am not causing bother by asking this question. What happens when Chariots (as used by the Hittite Empire) beat Skirmishers (as fielded by Minoan/Early Mycenaean armies) in open terrain, but do not double them? I can't see any 'Exception" referring to Skirmishers being beaten but not doubled on the Quick Reference Sheet for Triumph! v1.0 dated July 2018. When I looked at the main rules under 75.2 Shattered, I didn't see, see any reference to Skirmishers either. [The version that I referred to is Version 1.0 dated July 2018.]

We had to assume that the intention was for the Skirmishers to fall back, and not be destroyed. However, I noticed that a great many other infantry troop types are shattered by Chariots in open terrain. These include Light Foot, Light Spear, Rabble, Raiders, Warband, Warriors, Elite Foot, Heavy Foot, Horde, Pavisiers, Pike and Spear. In addition, Archers and Bow Levy get shattered by any mounted in open terrain.

Did we play it correctly? If so, I would be interested to know why Skirmishers are more resistant to Chariots in open terrain than nearly all infantry types, including such closely related troop types such as Rabble, Bow Levy and Archers.

Rod
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Re: Chariots beating Skirmishers, not by double

Postby Rod » Mon Jul 16, 2018 3:55 pm

Historicon was great, thanks.

Skirmishers fall back against mounted. They are not shattered. That is intentional, and it was finalized in the final version of the rules.

Bow Levy and Rabble are 2 point units (with delicate morale).

Archers are more dangerous to mounted, but if the mounted hit their formation and win, then it's not good for them.

Skirmishers are better than Bow Levy and Rabble. However being in lose formation, they are only a +1, so they already are weak in the open against mounted. They however have a chance of evading and escaping even in the open if the mounted don't win by doubling.

They do evade in rough terrain.

Piyan Glupak
Levy
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2017 1:42 pm
Location: Bulgaria

Re: Chariots beating Skirmishers, not by double

Postby Piyan Glupak » Mon Jul 16, 2018 4:31 pm

Thank you very much for your reply, Rod. I will let my opponent know the reasons why.

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David Kuijt
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Re: Chariots beating Skirmishers, not by double

Postby David Kuijt » Tue Jul 17, 2018 2:29 pm

Piyan Glupak wrote:Did we play it correctly? If so, I would be interested to know why Skirmishers are more resistant to Chariots in open terrain than nearly all infantry types, including such closely related troop types such as Rabble, Bow Levy and Archers.


Rod gives a good summary, but I wanted to point out one other point. You can't look at combat results (or combat factors) in isolation; you have to consider everything together. If I was facing Chariots in open terrain I'd much rather have three Bow Levy (6 pts) than two Skirmishers (6 pts). And Chariots just hate Archers -- the "shattered" combat result is there mostly as a tease; a force of Chariots facing Archers is going to go home weeping and sore. Skirmishers can't be considered as better than either of those in the open against Chariots.
DK

Rod
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Re: Chariots beating Skirmishers, not by double

Postby Rod » Tue Jul 17, 2018 3:33 pm

Good point DK, I should have quantified it as they are generally speaking better trained or quality troops and in theory can escape the Chariots. They are not necessarily cost effective over Bow Levy in the open facing Chariots.


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