Normans

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gmcalum2001
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Normans

Post by gmcalum2001 » Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:20 am

Good evening all....

I recently unearthed a good amount of Normans from Gladiator miniatures (who was bought out in 2006 by BlackHat). I have about 44 Crossbowmen and 30 Archers that are awaiting basing.

My question is: which would more likely to be considered bow levy? I ask for the purposes of basing and want to be accurate when my army is defeated:)

Thanks
Greg
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David Kuijt
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Re: Normans

Post by David Kuijt » Sat Dec 17, 2016 2:31 pm

Normans look like this:
  • 0-2x Bow Levy (bowmen)
  • 0-1x Archer or Skirmisher (crossbowmen or staff slingers)
That isn't going to use all your huge wad of figs, but what that means is that you can base up 2 stands of Bow Levy with your bowmen, 1 stand of Archers (4 figs) with your crossbowmen, and one stand of Skirmishers (2 figs) with your crossbowmen.

Morphing-wise, the same 0-2x Bow Levy (bowmen) are in the Ottonian Frankish and/or East Frankish armies.

Also morphing-wise, note that any figures that work for Normans will almost always also work for Early Crusader, who have the following:
  • 2-4x Bow Levy or Archer (crossbowmen)
  • 1-2x Bow Levy (bowmen)
So that gives you a lot more you can do with your crossbow figures -- up to 4 stands of Bow Levy and up to 4 stands of Archers.

Hope this helps.
DK
gmcalum2001
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Re: Normans

Post by gmcalum2001 » Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:07 pm

Very much so. Thanks!
Snowcat
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Re: Normans

Post by Snowcat » Fri Dec 23, 2016 11:32 pm

Except there are no Archers in the current Norman Invasion list.

??

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Snowcat
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Re: Normans

Post by Snowcat » Fri Dec 23, 2016 11:47 pm

While we're at it, do the Elite Foot represent surplus milites (whose horses weren't transported)? If so, I'm guessing they would best be represented by dismounted knights with swords combined with spearmen in heaviest armour. Thoughts?

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Rod
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Re: Normans

Post by Rod » Sat Dec 24, 2016 1:50 pm

The Archers can be used as Early Crusaders... (i.e. Normans in the Early Crusade list)...

And yes I would think the elite foot could be a mix of dismounted knights with Swords, Spears, Axes...
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David Kuijt
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Re: Normans

Post by David Kuijt » Sat Dec 24, 2016 1:57 pm

Snowcat wrote:While we're at it, do the Elite Foot represent surplus milites (whose horses weren't transported)? If so, I'm guessing they would best be represented by dismounted knights with swords combined with spearmen in heaviest armour.

The 3-4 Elite Foot in the Norman Invasion army represent Milites whose horses weren't transported, yes. I'd represent them as you say -- dismounted knights with swords, spearmen with mail and nasal helmet, all mixed and all with kite shields.

Regarding your earlier question, 0-2 Bow Levy is bowmen; 0-1x Skirmisher is crossbowmen.

The 0-2x Heavy Foot is typical spearmen; the 0-1x Spear represents a better class (better trained, more experienced) of mercenary spearmen.

The 0-1x Knight or Javelin Cavalry is either Milites (if Knights) or Milites who have removed their armor for greater mobility to scout.

And to finish it off, the 0-2x Horde represents a collection of peasants, grooms and horsehandlers, and other servants.
DK
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David Kuijt
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Re: Normans

Post by David Kuijt » Sat Dec 24, 2016 2:05 pm

Rod wrote:The Archers can be used as Early Crusaders... (i.e. Normans in the Early Crusade list)...

And yes I would think the elite foot could be a mix of dismounted knights with Swords, Spears, Axes...
Rod, I think you're answering the question "what do I do with my stands of Archers" rather than the question Snowcat was asking (which was more like "how come there aren't any Archers in the Norman Invasion list").

If you look through the Bayeux Tapestry, there are only like 7 figures in the whole enormous thing (70 freaking meters long) with bows, almost all completely unarmored (one in armor, IIRC) and mostly in the semi-decorative band at the bottom rather than in the main "story-line" larger band in the center. A large mass of effective distance-firing (non-skirmishing) bowmen, which is what an Archer stand would be, doesn't fit with that description.
DK
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Re: Normans

Post by Snowcat » Sun Dec 25, 2016 1:08 am

Excellent info David, thanks. :)

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Bill Hupp
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Re: Normans

Post by Bill Hupp » Sun Dec 25, 2016 10:43 pm

Hastings must be the most written about battle in all of medieval history. I can't place where I read this but there is no agreement about the Tapestry showing Harold dying from an arrow to the eye. There is some speculation that the arrow in the eye was added later, in addition there are those who interpret another figure as Harold.

I am hoping to try out the Hastings scenario for the Two Davids book this week. I ran it with the legacy system last year and it left me with some questions which I will be interested to see if Triumph! Can answer.

Bill
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