Questions about Light Foot and Shower Shooting

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Teric neDhalir
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Questions about Light Foot and Shower Shooting

Post by Teric neDhalir » Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:20 pm

Hi,
Working my way into Triumph! and a couple of questions;
1) 2nd Punic War and Roman Leves/Velites are now Rabble or Light Foot as are Carthaginian Javelinmen. My preconception is they should be out front skirmishing but that doesn't seem a good idea as they'll get squashed between the battle lines. Pointless arguing about the classification so my question is - where am I supposed to put them?
2) Some elite cavalry now have shower shooting but with ranged combat only being 3MU and shower only allowed if you haven't made a tactical move in your own turn then as a solo player I end up with a line of cavalry facing a line of foot and neither side wants to move into less than 3MU distance because the foot will be shot at or the cav can't fire (and then the foot charges). The Shower Shooting oddly becomes most effective in the enemy's turn after you've been recoiled in your own. Am I doing something wrong?
Cheers,
Teric
Making paper soldiers at 633ad.wordpress.com
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David Kuijt
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Re: Questions about Light Foot and Shower Shooting

Post by David Kuijt » Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:06 pm

Teric neDhalir wrote:
Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:20 pm
Hi,
Working my way into Triumph! and a couple of questions;
1) 2nd Punic War and Roman Leves/Velites are now Rabble or Light Foot as are Carthaginian Javelinmen. My preconception is they should be out front skirmishing but that doesn't seem a good idea as they'll get squashed between the battle lines. Pointless arguing about the classification so my question is - where am I supposed to put them?
2) Some elite cavalry now have shower shooting but with ranged combat only being 3MU and shower only allowed if you haven't made a tactical move in your own turn then as a solo player I end up with a line of cavalry facing a line of foot and neither side wants to move into less than 3MU distance because the foot will be shot at or the cav can't fire (and then the foot charges). The Shower Shooting oddly becomes most effective in the enemy's turn after you've been recoiled in your own. Am I doing something wrong?
Cheers,
Teric
(2): Elite Cavalry evade against most foot. And you can usually put them in a position where if they charge out into the open they will be giving up a flank or overlaps on your turn.

(1): Rabble panic against most close-order foot. If you position your own line carefully, their initial fall-back will take them through the friendly line before they flip and run (fall-back happens first). And this will disorder the enemy line through mandatory pursuit. Yes, you have to do it carefully, but it works fine. If you don't suffer a sudden pip drought, of course.
DK
JonathanJ
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Re: Questions about Light Foot and Shower Shooting

Post by JonathanJ » Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:25 am

David Kuijt wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:06 pm

(1): Rabble panic against most close-order foot. If you position your own line carefully, their initial fall-back will take them through the friendly line before they flip and run (fall-back happens first). And this will disorder the enemy line through mandatory pursuit. Yes, you have to do it carefully, but it works fine. If you don't suffer a sudden pip drought, of course.
I thought that only skirmishers could pass through close order foot?
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David Kuijt
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Re: Questions about Light Foot and Shower Shooting

Post by David Kuijt » Tue Feb 14, 2023 2:07 am

JonathanJ wrote:
Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:25 am
David Kuijt wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:06 pm

(1): Rabble panic against most close-order foot. If you position your own line carefully, their initial fall-back will take them through the friendly line before they flip and run (fall-back happens first). And this will disorder the enemy line through mandatory pursuit. Yes, you have to do it carefully, but it works fine. If you don't suffer a sudden pip drought, of course.
I thought that only skirmishers could pass through close order foot?
Right you are -- I was writing unclearly.

Which means you need to take more care -- perhaps some peltasts or similar (light foot or raiders). If you're Carthos, Gallic Warband or Celtiberian Raiders are excellent. For the Romans it is more problematic -- but the Romans weren't very subtle at this point. A double line of rabble can pull enemy close-order foot out of position, though.
DK
JonathanJ
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Re: Questions about Light Foot and Shower Shooting

Post by JonathanJ » Tue Feb 14, 2023 9:21 pm

DK,
Thanks for the clarification. I admit I was thinking of OP's Romans when I asked.

I've paired warband and rabble this way before... with mixed results... It is glorious when it works!
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Rod
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Re: Questions about Light Foot and Shower Shooting

Post by Rod » Tue Feb 14, 2023 10:50 pm

Keep in mind Rabble are also sort of "expendable" troops. You can afford to lose a couple if necessary to gain a significant advantage, like a hole in the enemy line after your elite foot crush a double overlapped enemy unit.

But leaving a hole for them to run through works great too. Try using a double rank of Rabble with Elite Foot on the flanks of the second rank alternating against Pike armies.
Last edited by Rod on Wed Feb 15, 2023 11:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
Teric neDhalir
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Re: Questions about Light Foot and Shower Shooting

Post by Teric neDhalir » Wed Feb 15, 2023 9:25 am

Thanks for your replies everyone.
Making paper soldiers at 633ad.wordpress.com
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greedo
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Re: Questions about Light Foot and Shower Shooting

Post by greedo » Tue Apr 18, 2023 4:41 am

I never thought about it this way.

With skirmishers, you can have them out front of the main heavy line no worries. And, you can even have them a couple of base widths in front of the main line. It won’t matter as they’ll alway just pass through or evade through the heavies.


But rabble you have to a) have them immediately in front of the front line (no gaps), and b) they need to be in front of other lights to be able to pass through at all…

So it still works for rabble with some restrictions.

This is great to know.
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